Dry Age Bags...

[Justin]

straw technique seems to work well, I have not tried it but I will

[Wade]

Bresaola update

After 20 days hanging in muslin the Bresaola has developed a little surface mould. This is natural and is treated by spraying the surface with a fine mist of 50% vinegar in water. If it is still developing after a further week then apply the spray again. It is best to use a non flavoured malt vinegar or white wine vinegar. The vinegar reduces the pH of the muslin surface (increases the acidity) which inhibits bacterial and mould growth.

You will also notice that the meat has noticeably shrunk and I have added additional end ties to keep the muslin tight

[Wade]

Having weighed the Bresaola and Pancetta yesterday I found that the muslin died meats had both lost ~30% of their weight and were ready, whereas the dry age bag meats in the fridge had only lost ~9% and so still had a long way to go.

Here are the muslin dried meats sliced and packed

The dry age bags have gone back in the fridge and will be weighed again in a month

[sotv]

They look great from the photos, especially the pancetta, wish i hadn't mucked mine up. Got me drooling

[Wade]

The flavour of both was really good though out of the two  Bresoula is the one I prefer.

[Smokin Monkey]

Great looking Charcuterie Wade!

Odvious the bags do not breath as good as Muslim.

[MarcWillm]

Hi Wade,

Excellent update! I did not realise that muslin would do such a great job, i imagine the trick with the vinegar really helps too.

Smoking Monkey, you are correct the Dry Age Bags are only Semi Permeable but they also act as a good barrier against bacteria and off or odd smells. 

I am just in the middle of moving but once i am settled i will be Dry Ageing some Venison as some of the cuts can be quite tough. 

 

[Wade]

10 hours ago, MarcWillm said:

Excellent update! I did not realise that muslin would do such a great job, i imagine the trick with the vinegar really helps too.

Smoking Monkey, you are correct the Dry Age Bags are only Semi Permeable but they also act as a good barrier against bacteria and off or odd smells. 

I am just in the middle of moving but once i am settled i will be Dry Ageing some Venison as some of the cuts can be quite tough. 

Good luck with your house moving - it can be quite a stressful time...

For centuries muslin cloth has been the method for protecting meats as they cure and it was also traditionally used to protect lamb meat while it was being transported (hence it also being called "mutton cloth"). It will not stop airborne bacteria or moulds from coming into contact with the meat but it is there to act as a physical barrier against insects and other pests.

The sight of mould on the surface can discourage people new to home curing and the vinegar application will keep it at bay. The formation of a layer of "good" mould on the surface actually helps to protect the meat from bacteria though. In the traditional Charcuterie producing regions there are literally hundreds of different types of mould that are naturally encouraged to grow on the surface of the drying meat and most of these are from the Penicillium genus - which is why they are good at keeping bacteria at bay. By preferentially colonising the surface of the meat they also out-compete the growth of other, less desirable, moulds. For home Charcuterie some people use the surface mould scraped from shop bought salami or chorizo  to start a surface mould culture, however we can now buy one of these moulds (Penicillium nalgiovense or Penicillium Candidum) which makes the process easier (but it is quite expensive). Fortunately this produces penicillin in such low quantities that the mould coating a piece of dry-cured meat is not a concern to those with penicillin allergies.

Looking forward to seeing the Venison. Will you be just dry ageing it or will you be dry curing it?

[Justin]

Exactly right. I have a penicillin allergy but no problem with this.

[Justin]

This is the definite thread on dry aging meats, keep it going Wade, Thank you

[Wade]

I am getting bored waiting for the Bresaola in the dry bags in the fridge to lose their moisture so I decided to wrap one in muslin (still in the Dry Age bag) and hang it at room temperature. The dry age bag itself does not need to be kept chilled and so there is no need to keep it refrigerated. I am looking to see the difference in water loss between the fridge and at room temperature. I am also looking to see whether using the semi-permeable Dry Age bag underneath the muslin helps to regulate the moisture loss so that we minimise the surface hardening of the meat. If this works (and I am not sure if it will) then we could possibly use the Dry Age bags to dry the meat more easily at room temperature and avoid the need for a curing cabinet. If you don't try it you will never know ?

One of the Bresaolas now also wrapped in muslin

The one just in the Dry Age bag is back in the fridge and the other is in my hanging area at a constant 19 C

[Wade]

UPDATE...

Six days on and I weighed both of the Bresaolas. The one air drying in muslin had lost a further 10% of its weight whereas the one in the fridge had only lost only another 2%. To the touch both felt firm and with no indication of surface hardening.

The total weight loss we are looking for is ~30% and so far the Muslin wrapped meat has lost a total of 16% - it is therefore just over half way there. The one that is still remaining in the fridge has only lost a total of 11%.

[Wade]

UPDATE and conclusion...

After 68 days the Bresaola that was in the Dry Age bag in the fridge for 50 days and then wrapped in muslin and air dried had reached its target weight loss of 30%

The weight losses highlighted in blue are when the meat was in the fridge and the losses highlighted in red were kept at room temperature.

Below is the weight loss shown on a graph. The arrow shows where one was taken out of the fridge and then allowed to air dry at room temperature.

As the rates of loss seemed to be fairly constant when in the fridge and then when air drying I extrapolated to estimate the number of days that the meat would have taken to reach 30% if remaining in the fridge or left to dry entirely at room temperature.

• Dry Age bag in fridge - 153 days (just over 5 months)
• Dry Age bag at room temperature* - 18 days

* Hung in an air conditioned kitchen at 20 C. If hung in a cooler room or in a room that was more humid then this time would be extended.

As with the one without the Dry Age bag the muslin and ties were looking much looser after hanging. One big difference was the lack of any visible mould showing through the muslin with the Dry Age bag - though it may just not have had sufficient time to develop when taken out of the fridge.

With the muslin removed there was a thin film of powdery white mould showing. This appeared similar to the mould found on commercial air dried meats. No green or black mould was visible.

When the Dry Age bag was removed there was no mould visible on the surface of the meat.

When sliced, the Bresaola had a good texture and flavour without sign of significant surface hardening

Conclusion

It appears that in this trial the Dry Age bag did control the mould from colonising the surface of the meat and it allowed the meat to dry without the surface becoming hardened. It will be worth repeating this trial without the initial period in the fridge to see whether the same is true when dried entirely at room temperature.

The trial also shows that the weight loss that occurs when the meat in the Dry Age bag remains in the fridge is too slow to make it a practical method of producing Bresaola for most people.

[sotv]

What a stunning looking piece of meat, and I bet the taste is amazing. Wish mine had worked out. But a great guide and explanation on the process for this method. Thanks again Wade

If I try again in the future, is a dark airing cupboard an option to hang it, to mature, or does it need daylight and a decent airflow?

[Justin]

Looks to me form reading this that muslin not dry age bags is the way?

 

And out of fridge for drying, ie the traditional way?

Edited January 14, 2019 by Justin

[Wade]

41 minutes ago, Justin said:

Looks to me form reading this that muslin not dray age bags is the way?

And out of fridge for drying, ie the traditional way?

I think that using the bag inside the muslin will prove to be best as the Dry Age bag certainly seemed to act as an effective mould barrier. I am about to repeat the Bresaola using the bag and muslin at room temperature. I want to see whether the bag will help to reduce any surface hardening. The Muslin is there to protect the surface of the meat/bag from airborne mould and unwanted critters.

Ideally the meat is best cured at cooler humid temperatures (a curing cabinet is good) but the bag could help slow the water loss at higher temperatures without surface hardening. 

I will post the method I use and the results in a new thread.

[Wade]

1 hour ago, sotv said:

What a stunning looking piece of meat, and I bet the taste is amazing.

It has a lovely deep flavour from the cure/marinade. The smoky flavour was less than I would have expected though - but this one was smoked after it had been sealed in the bag. I will try them next time by smoking one before bagging and one after.

[Justin]

Nice one mate, I will try too I think. Once i have sliced up and bagged  bacon last this week. Great work Wade

Edited October 29, 2018 by Justin

[Justin]

I have just spotted in Lidl 1kg loin pork for £5.  Probably pumped with water but whatever. I figure cheap cut cure it. Got to start somewhere

 

As this is my learning curve, not sure what flavours to add to cure # 2 ( Wade's prague powder for bacon  kit).

Not sure  whether to do dry cure or dissolve and do injection method.

Dry cure I think. Blitz the salt and sugar to a powder  mix with cure and coat and put in vac and wrap.

Will add 1% smoked paprika power and 1% pepper to so that is 10g of each per kilo?

Therefore step one 2.4G cure #2, 22.6g salt

12.5g sugar. 10g smoked paprika , 10g ground pepper.

Leave it for 1 week per inch thickness turning every day.

@Wade.  You agree with this ?

 

[Justin]

Looking ahead no where in my house is it constant 19 degs c

I suppose could use the ceramic bulb in a cardboard box and hang it in in there, easy to rig up. i can put a baffle between the bulb the  meat? Good idea?.

Target  is to get to 660g from 1kg.

 

Edited December 3, 2018 by Justin

[Justin]

Sure is quite this week on here, I am going for it. Going to rig up a cardboard box with double baffle indoors with bulb heater to try and get something like constant temp when I hang it, double the baffle because the one nearest the bulb will heat up leading to too slow a variable  in thermostat and the second one will even that out I think.  Trouble I have is the thermostat demands a 4 degrees difference between heat and cool so need to anticipate that to peak at 19 20 degs c

 

meat weigh 1000g, now vacced  and will leave for 1st step wet cure 1 week per inch thickness, 3 inches thick equals 3 weeks, boxing day. then it is stage 2 dry cure fridge stage for 2 weeks. 

 

 

[Justin]

@Wade

[Wade]

On 12/3/2018 at 5:04 PM, Justin said:

I have just spotted in Lidl 1kg loin pork for £5.  Probably pumped with water but whatever. I figure cheap cut cure it. Got to start somewhere

As this is my learning curve, not sure what flavours to add to cure # 2 ( Wade's prague powder for bacon  kit).

Not sure  whether to do dry cure or dissolve and do injection method.

Dry cure I think. Blitz the salt and sugar to a powder  mix with cure and coat and put in vac and wrap.

Will add 1% smoked paprika power and 1% pepper to so that is 10g of each per kilo?

Therefore step one 2.4G cure #2, 22.6g salt

12.5g sugar. 10g smoked paprika , 10g ground pepper.

Leave it for 1 week per inch thickness turning every day.

@Wade.  You agree with this ?

As it is a "Basted" pork joint it will have up to 10% of brine added. This will have already increased the salt content so I would reduce the amount of salt that you add. For the cure calculation if you use this type of joint again I would reduce the actual weight by 5% to account in part for the water already added. 

For making air dried pork then yes you could use the smoked paprika and pepper however you may want to create a more traditional cure that includes a combination of Thyme, Juniper, garlic, Fennel seed, Black pepper, bay leaf. Whichever flavour you use you will not need more than ~10-12 g of flavouring per Kg of meat and so if using the  paprika and pepper I would reduce them down to 6 g of each. If you have already added 10 g of each then that is fine but you will get a stronger flavour.

The total time you would need to leave it in the cure is 10-14 days - 3 weeks will be too long. I am not sure what you mean by the first stage being a wet cure and the second being a dry cure. Can you explain further what you plan to do?

From the experience I had trying to use the dry age bags in the fridge, they do not work well when trying to produce dried meats. I did not get the resulting weight loss that I was expecting until I removed it completely from the fridge. I have recently repeated the trial using the dry age bag with much more success.

1. Cure the meat as you would for bacon - vac packed in the fridge
2. Rinse, dry off and then vac pack in dry age bag
3. Wrap in muslin and then hang at cool room temperature to dry (12-20 C - the closer to 12 C the better)
4. Monitor the weight every 4-5 days.

I will be posting up my recent bresaola batch soon - which used this same method. I have already sold most of it at Brogdale on Sunday.

[Justin]

Oh i did not realise what basted meant, my wife neither,  figured it mean fat cap added and no basting required if you roast it.. I do now, thx.

Oh well it is in now in vac like bacon based on the ratios i made, too late for that now. It only cost a fiver so if it goes wrong so be it. I like to learn from mistakes as it is hard to know what good is  if bad not understood. This is why i bought cheap. I agree it is not the best cut but supermarket  preserved for shelf life pork.  Cock it up maybe this time, Butchers next time.

Once Christmas is over I will get another one and put it on.

I might have to rinse it a lot after the fridge vac stage 1 in your list (wet cure) like i do with salmon and bacon

Looks like stronger flavour too.  as I added 10g smoked paprika powder and 10g blitzed szechaun red pepper

Wet cure is in bag extracting water, dry cure is after that hanging etc...

close to 12 degrees, ok thanks mate in which case it will be fine, i will just move it to the coldest room when it get to dry stage.

 

We see see how it goes, I am following your four stage list as you have shown in the thread mate, learning curve and then 2nd time I will be more confident. I

[Wade]

2 minutes ago, Justin said:

Oh i did not realise what basted meant, my wife neither,  figured it mean fat cap added and no basting required if you roast it.. I do now, thx.

It is the same with "ready basted" turkeys - they have already been brine injected.

3 minutes ago, Justin said:

I might have to rinse it a lot after the fridge vac stage 1 in your list (wet cure) like i do with salmon and bacon

Looks like stronger flavour too.  as I added 10g smoked paprika powder and 10g blitzed szechaun red pepper

10 g of Szechuan  pepper - WOW. At least you won't have to worry about the hot smoked paprika burning your mouth as it will be too numbed to feel it from all that Szechuan pepper .
No - seriously - leave it as it is and see how it turns out. It is a LOT of Szechuan pepper but it does have a nice citrus flavour

8 minutes ago, Justin said:

close to 12 degrees, ok thanks mate in which case it will be fine, i will just move it to the coldest room when it get to dry stage.

We see see how it goes, I am following your four stage list as you have shown in the thread mate, learning curve and then 2nd time I will be more confident. I

I think it will work out OK - It will be great to hear how it tastes