Wade

Hi Eddie and welcome to the forum. We can certainly help you to get started with your curing. It isn't rocket science and you will soon get the confidence to experiment with your own flavours. Cheers, Wade

Can you post a photo

You may want to contact the guys at The American BBQ company as I think they sometimes know of used ones that are available - https://www.americanbbq.co.uk/ Also keep a watch on ebay as they do pop up there from time to time.

You may want to consider cutting a small hole in the door and inserting some glass - or maybe a small hinged wooden hatch that you could open to peek at the smoke generator without opening the whole door.

But Ice - they are not yellow !!!

Hi both and welcome to the forum

Looks really good. Let us know how it pulled 👍

On your first point I was responding to the recipe that you quoted where he was calling for 500 g of salt per 2 Kg of meat - that is 25%. Yes, a lot of the salt will be lost with the run off of the resulting brine - but it would be hard to reproduce between batches and the results (for me anyway) were still WAY too salty. The positive thing about this method is that there is no possibility of there being an excess of Nitrate/Nitrite. The length of time that "meat" will keep is dependent on several things - and is usually a combination of several. There is also some clarity of meaning needed when we refer to the words we use to describe the types of bacon/meat we are making. Generally the label "dry-cure" in bacon is different to the process used to produce something like Bresaola. Both start with a similar process to introduce the cure into the meat - but generally "dry cure" bacon is only taken as far as the initial curing stage. It still has a relatively high water content (a water activity of ~0.92-0.96) and so is relying totally on the cure and salt to inhibit bacterial growth and prevent the fat from going rancid. To then get it to the "bacon" that you are referring to that lasts for 2 years in a ship then you have to take the process beyond what most people class as "dry cure" for bacon. It is then being further "air dried" slowly in a humidity controlled environment. This allows for longer term preservation by reducing the water activity 0.9 and below. I have not tasted the type of 2 year old ship bacon to with you refer but I expect it would taste incredibly salty and its low moisture content would give it a texture more similar to jerky. We are taking crossed purposes here. I think that you are trying to mix what people usually call "dry-cured bacon" with air dried meats like Parma ham or Country Ham. Yes the curing process begins in a similar way but the Parma-style hams have to be taken a lot further. If you bought a commercial pack of "dry cured" bacon from a butcher or supermarket you would not get it to last for more than a few weeks in the fridge before it noticeably deteriorated. Shelf life is also determined by legislation and this is driven by individual producers having to prove to the Environmental Health that their product is safe - usually through lab testing. The relatively high water content of what most people call "bacon" means that the maximum shelf life is about 6-8 weeks (at 4C) before you get signs of spoilage. Take the meat to the point where most people would call it Charcuterie, Bresaola or Country ham etc. then, yes it will last for many months/years. It is great to discuss the process of curing and the more awareness people have the more informed and confident they become. I am sure that your post has raised questions that others have thought about but have not had the confidence to ask.

From the method you have described and the meat being fully cured it should be safe. Use the vinegar spray above to help deal with the mold spots. Used sparingly this should not affect the flavour of the end bacon. Let us know how you get on

Hi Clive and welcome to the forum I think your experiences are very similar to many of us who go on to make our own bacon. The reason why most commercial bacon produces the white foam is that it is injection cured and ~10% of additional water is added to the meat as the cure is injected. When the bacon is then cooked the additional water is driven out of the meat, along with meat proteins, and it is the proteins denaturing that forms the white foam. When cooking a lot of bacon in a single pan so much water is released from the meat that you end up boiling the bacon slices before the water has had time to evaporate and the bacon starts to fry. Once this has happened the protein starts to also fry and then burn before the meat has fully cooked. In the 1960 the long term effect of Nitrates/Nitrites on human health were not as well known as they are today. Over the centuries many regional methods were developed for preserving meat and the use of saltpeter was very important. To begin with they would have had to use higher quantities of "saltpeter" as it was not a pure as the chemical grade saltpeter we have today. Also the long term effects of high doses would probably not have been particularly apparent as illness and death from other causes would probably have masked any risk from Nitrate poisoning. Let us look at the math for the Jane Grigson recipe... 1 ounce of Saltpeter (Potassium Nitrate) = 28.3 grams = 28,300 mg 2.5 Pounds of Salt (Sodium Chloride) = 1.143 Kg 12 Pounds of meat = 5.4 Kg We can ignore the salt in the calculation as this does not contribute to the amount of nitrate If applying all of the cure to the whole 5.4 Kg of meat you would end up applying the Nitrate at a concentration of 28,300/5.4 = 5,241 mg/Kg (or ppm) Bearing in mind that the levels of Nitrite/Nitrate that are considered safe in commercial bacon is 150 mg/Kg then this recipe is 35 times higher than the accepted safe concentration. This is high but when it is put into perspective, a single rasher of bacon weighs about 14 g and so would contain about 73 mg of Nitrate. The lethal dose is accepted to be between 4-50 grams and the toxic dose is between 2-5 grams. You would need to eat a lot of the bacon to reach these amounts. The bigger problem is that this bacon Nitrate would be additional to what you are eating in the rest of your diet. Babies/children are especially susceptible to levels of Nitrate and so this would certainly not be good to feed to them. This also only addresses the short term effect of the Nitrate and not the effects of the longer term exposure. Bearing in mind that the ingoing Nitrate levels are already very high in this recipe there are further issues with how someone may interpret the phrase "such a quantity would cure 12 lbs of meat". If they interpreted it to mean that it would cure exactly 5.4 Kg of meat then the calculations above remain true - however if the interpreted it as this would cure "UP TO" 5.4 Kg of meat - and the whole amount was used to cure, say, 2 Kg of meat then the levels would be even more toxic. This method would certainly help to reduce the amount of Nitrate that enters the meat as much of it would dissolve in the water that is drawn from the meat by the salt and would be washed away. Unfortunately by then adding more of the cure mixture to the meat you introduce so many variables that you no way of knowing just how much Nitrate ends up in the final bacon without having it lab tested. Is it safe or isn't it? Depending on how much of it you eat, and over what period of time, it could end up as slow motion Russian Roulette. Do not confuse the amount of water that is in commercial injection cured bacon (that produces the froth) with the natural residual water that is in the recipes for dry cured bacon. When dry curing bacon you are not adding any additional water. The dry curing process with vac packing does result in water loss as the the salt does draw out moisture (which is released when the pack is opened) and the resting process and the smoking leads to further water loss. The main purpose of vac packing (or curing in a tight sealed plastic bag) is that you know for certain EXACTLY how much of the Nitrate/Nitrite you are adding to your meat. It is safer and instills higher levels of confidence - especially for people starting out curing. Yes very high levels of Nitrate/Nitrite will help extend the storage - however it also increases human toxicity. Over time the additional air drying as the meat hangs also contributes to its preservation. Unless you have a cool cellar or an old fashioned larder, it is much harder to develop the same conditions in a modern house. Trying to store it in a modern centrally heated house with low humidity would not be equivalent to what you are suggesting. I have tried the River Cottage curing recipe and to compensate for the lack of Nitrite they use very high quantities of salt (25%). This, and the high amount of sugar, helps to reduce the amount of free water in the meat and therefore inhibit bacterial growth. The sugar is also there to disguise the amount of salt when it is eaten. Such high amounts of sugar in the recipe also results in the bacon burning much quicker when it is being fried. My experience with this recipe is that, even though a relatively small amount of salt is absorbed, it still makes the bacon exceedingly salty - to the point where I could not eat it and ended up using it as lardons. Everyone's salt tolerances are different and from your comment yours appears to be high. There is no single right way to cure and everyone develops their own variations. The important thing though is to understand exactly what you are doing, or if not follow a recipe that others have previously validated. The safety of any curing method on the forum is governed by our general food safety advice https://www.woodsmokeforum.uk/topic/36-about-woodsmoke-forum-food-safety-advice/. Unfortunately, these days the Jane Grigson method would no longer be considered as being a safe method. Unfortunately there are no legal guidelines for home curing (as there are for commercial curing) and, in effect, you are free to eat what you produce. You would get into difficulty though if what you produced at home was unsafe and you had given it to others and it had caused them to become unwell. You certainly would not be able to sell it without your method being proven to the satisfaction of Environmental Health. It is good that you are thinking laterally and trying to explore different curing options. Unfortunately from experience, and from a legal liability perspective, most curing forums, including this one, would not be able to condone the Jane Grigson method. Discussion is great and I think you for your contribution

Hi Young Tom and welcome to the forum Surfeys (sausagemaking.org) is a good supplier for cure. I also agree that the celebrity curing methods usually produce a bacon that is way too salty. A couple of questions regarding your bacon. What is the purpose of air drying it - are you looking to produce a "Parma Ham" style charcuterie or a standard dry cure bacon? Which cure did you use (#1 or #2) and how much did you use? If you are trying to produce charcutarie then the mold is easily addressed by lightly spraying with diluted vinegar (50:50) and wiping off any excess mold and liquid. The acetic acid in the vinegar will kill the mold and will inhibit further mold growth. You may need to repeat this every few weeks. You may want to wrap the bacon in several layers of muslin (or use an air dry curing bag) in future as these help prevent mold spores, and unwanted critters, from getting to the meat surface. If you are looking to produce fully air dried ham then did you use Cure #2 (Nitrite and Nitrate)? Cure #1 is not suitable for long duration cures as the Nitrite breaks down fairly quickly and it require the additional Nitrate to slowly convert to Nitrite to keep the levels topped up. Did you use a dry cure method or did you immersion brine it? The reason for asking what you are trying to produce and your method is important as when producing a standard dry cure bacon (rather than charcuterie) the meat should be kept refrigerated. Could you let us know a little more detail about your process so far and we can offer some more focused advice. Cheers, Wade

The link still seems to be working for me - you have to download it to run it. I will email you a copy.

Whenever you slice your bacon you usually end up with with off-cuts. Depending on how much bacon you make, these can usually be used as lardons. I usually freeze mine and when I have enough I add them to some belly pork (75% belly pork 25% bacon off-cuts) and make them in to bacon sausages. These are amazing and are great to make sausage toad or bangers and mash even more exciting. Bacon sausages on the right in the smoker. They were part of a 30 Kg batch of various kielbasa/sausages I made for Christmas.

Sounds like the standard cop-out phase they have used in the past. Blaming others for their own lack of clear decision making. Oops - do I sound cynical ??

So Jill has put you on a diet at last. Don't fret too much though - Joyce has had me on a diet for years and I have survived 😎

The flat for me. A more even slice and, to be honest, most of the flavour is actually from the cure/rub/marinade/injection anyway. The meat gives the flavors texture. When we judge competition BBQ we look for the point where Brisket ceases to be Brisket and becomes Pastrami. That point is reached when the flavour of the meat becomes less pronounced than the flavours of the things added to it. Use Point or Flat. Both will taste great.

I was told that too - and believed it until I tried it. Some hickory pellets come as pure hickory and others as a hickory/oak mix. Both are good.

I really like smoking with Hickory. It is a fairly sweet wood that gives a distinctive rounded flavour.

Thanks for the photos - they make things easier to visualise. The first think I would try is to drill the top vent holes a little larger. You can do this with the vent cover in place - just drill through both the cover and the lid together. Increasing each hole diameter by just a couple of millimetres will significantly increase the total area of the vent holes.

A good tip when cooking at low outside temperatures is to get an old fire blanket (or welders blanket) and drape it over the kettle to insulate it. You will obvioudly need to cut a hole for the handle and the top vent.

Hi Carlos. Could you upload a couple of photos of your kettle that show the top and bottom vents as well as the whole BBQ. I suspect that this is could still be an air flow problem but without seeing the photos it is hard to be certain. There was a similar problem with the original Callow smoker as that was difficult to get much above 100 C. I worked closely with Callow to help them overcome their initial design problems and, following the testing of a series of replacement modified parts, the current design was finalised - which now has good all-round temperature control. To cut a long redesign story short, several changes were made, including a complete fire bowl redesign and the re-location of the bottom vents. Even by adding a 4th bottom vent it was still a problem getting the unit up to the higher temperatures - but the breakthrough came when we added a second top vent. Suddenly the high temperature heat problems disappeared. I suspect that your top vent/s could be too small and that is restricting the air flow through the cooking chamber, and therefore over the coals. As you know the temperature is regulated by the amount of oxygen passing over the coals and this will be depleted during the burn. The low oxygen air then dramatically increases in volume as it us heated and passes through the cooking chamber and tries to exit through the top vent. It is a bit like the principle of a jet engine and it can sometimes be seen as smoke exiting the top vent as a jet - like steam coming out of a boiling kettle. If the hot exhaust air cannot get out fast enough then the low oxygen, higher pressure air backs up to the coals and lowers the amount of new oxygen rich air from entering through the bottom vents. It is the equivalent of effectively shutting down the intake vents. Eventually an equilibrium will be reached where the coals are burning all the restricted amount of oxygen that is reaching them. One of the things I would try is to make your existing top vents bigger. Try to enlarge the existing ones first and remove any top control. If you need to drill another hole do this beside the existing vent (rather than on the other side of the lid) as keeping the exhaust vents together allows you to control the direction of air flow through the cooking chamber by the orientation of the lid. I think that once you have the air flow volume sorted you are going to need the bottom vent controller to help keep the cooking temperatures down.

Hi Russ and welcome to the forum. It is great news that you have built your own cold smoker. Do you have some photos you can share? People on here smoke using a wide range of cold smokers - from simple cardboard boxes, through kettle and bullet smokers, to professional cold smokers. Each have their advantages and challenges. Have you tried cold smoking salmon before? If so then it would be good to hear how you do it as everyone has a slightly different method. If not then let us know which method you are planning to use and we may be able to offer some advice. Have you tried curing your own bacon before? If not then it is very straightforward and we can give you some good pointers. Cheers Wade

There is nothing wrong with a cheap kettle BBQ. @valve90210 brought his along to several smoking weekends and smoked some serious BBQ. He would probably say that you were overcharged as I think he paid £10 for his 😎 A lot of us started using kettles. I smoked on Weber 57cm for many years (before they were readily available in the UK) and once you have mastered the charcoal layout and temperature control they are good almost every type of cook. Their limitations tend to be the amount of attention needed to maintain a steady cooking temperature and the limited space. There are several additional challenges you often find with the generic (no-name) kettles that you don't find with the Webers - the height of the lid (the Weber domes are usually higher), the bottom air vents (there is often little, or no, control with the no-name), and the height of the cooking grate. It looks as if you are no stranger to "modding" your BBQ and so you will not have any problems. A couple of questions/suggestions - and I am sorry if I am teaching you to suck eggs... Are you using the charcoal snake method to help give steady temperatures over those long cooks. Using this method a single charge of charcoal can give you 6-8 hours of cooking time at ~120 C Instead of simply drilling holes for your air intake, have you tried using an air vent damper? https://www.gsproducts.co.uk/stainless-steel-lockable-round-vents/?gclid=Cj0KCQiAgomBBhDXARIsAFNyUqMcAxPuKWWuOuCAActZMULvUkZ0TTUhJj32K3iygg3RsqAkJMr1-t4aAtrrEALw_wcB. This will really help you with your fine temperature control. Are you using good quality briquettes as your fire base. The quality of briquette can make a big difference to the stability of the smoke. The use of foil within the smoker (especially directly over the snake) to help control the air flow within the kettle smoking chamber will really help when you are trying to maintain steady low temperatures Always cook with the top vents fully open. In most cases your temperature control should be only through using the bottom vents.

Hi Carl and welcome to the forum. What do you enjoy doing - hot smoking, cold smoking, grilling? We have members here with a wide range of equipment types - what have you been using? It is always good to hear other peoples experiences and learn from them, and it will be good to find what has, and has not, worked for you